00:38   Effendil  Ready to pull out ?
00:38   XSI     I still can't get into sleep paralysis properly, but if you try, it would be apreciated if you tried puling me out
00:38   Lookis  sure
00:38   Codifier        It's like 4:30
00:39   Codifier        Why are you APing now?
00:39   Lookis  Cause I'm bored
00:39   Lookis  and wanna go talk to my old waifu
00:39   mqi3    Ahahahahahaha.
00:39   Effendil        Wait, how can you know where we are and who we are mostly?
00:40   mqi3    Effendil, I'm pretty sure the theory behind it is that the user's nickname has some meaning to the user, and acts as a sigil.
00:40   Lookis  also
00:40   Lookis  room pics.
00:40   mqi3    Which would explain why Van couldn't find me, as mqi3 has literally no meaning to me.
00:40   Effendil        Hmm, so room pics and username ?
00:41   Codifier        Mhm
00:41   Codifier        Just for future note, btw, I identify most with ConsciousCode
00:41   Codifier        I chose this nick as a throwaway because I was "codifying" the idea
00:41   Codifier        And I honestly didn't expect much out of that post
00:42   Effendil        My bedroom is in a mess...
00:43   Effendil        Celestia herself would avoid to AP here.
00:43           *** abadual joined #astralponies
00:44   Lookis  XSI
00:44   Lookis  lemme know when you're ready
00:44   Lookis  I think this time I'm gonna go to the Zero No Tsukaima world then drive a mech in NGE.
00:44   Lookis  Speaking of
00:44   Lookis  if any of you play mechwarrior online
00:44   Lookis  add me
00:45   Effendil        I'll try APing also.
00:45   mqi3    I hope ponies won't try to read my mind.
00:46   Effendil        I hope too, the stuff there is not safe.
00:46   mqi3    I say some weird shit.
00:46   Whoovsies       I hope ponies read my mind.
00:46   Whoovsies       They realise I fap to tempt.
00:50   XSI     Here now
00:50   XSI     Going to go do the SP thing
00:50   XSI     Or try anyway
00:50   Effendil        good luck
00:54   Effendil        AP to the version of Equestria with Cupcakes story.
00:54   Lookis  why
00:54   Lookis  >best pone killing second best pone
00:54   Effendil        I'm just wondering the horror.
00:55   Forge   so did anyone else try validating vans celestia or was that just me
00:55   Effendil        And Forge talking...
00:55   Lookis  I tried that when he first brought somepony over
00:55   Codifier        Why does it matter, Forge?
00:55   Forge   because that particular celestia exists only in vans mind
00:55   Forge   no where else
00:55   Forge   hasent even been to the astral
00:55   Codifier        And you know this how?
00:55   Forge   tracking
00:55   Effendil        So you believed there is no Equestria astral plane ?
00:55   Codifier        And again I ask
00:56   Codifier        Why does this matteR?
00:56   Forge   Effendil i didnt say that
00:56   Codifier        He's the naysayer
00:56   Forge   Codifier remember the rules, no more debating with each other and no more shoving your nihilist shit down my throat
00:56   Corr    hey forge
00:56   Codifier        The same applies to you and your ideas.
00:57   Effendil        If we could APing to their plane, why entities there come here ?
00:57   Codifier        I'm just stating what you've made clear
00:57   Effendil        couldn't come here...
00:57   Forge   Effendil the fuck
00:57   Forge   can you rephrase that
00:57   Corr   
00:58   Codifier        Huh
00:58   Effendil        If we can go to Equestria by astral projection, what prevents them from coming here by the same means?
00:58   Codifier        Imma save that
00:58   Lookis  Well
00:58   Lookis  Imma go AP
00:58   Forge   the veil
00:58   Lookis  >mech warrior finished patching
00:58   Lookis  nevermind
00:58   Codifier        Effendil, theoretical infinite copies of our universe
00:58   Codifier        While they could come to this specific one, they can also go to any of the minor variations on it
00:59   Forge   and tracking, which is following the flows of energy attached to a certain object, idea, or being, which is a very common technique, lead nowhere in the astral, only to vans mind, all around his mind, but not out of it
00:59   Codifier        The reason Van's Celestia and others come here is because they know Van
00:59   Forge   which was disappointing
00:59   Effendil        But they could go in the right universe if they used Van as an anchor.
00:59   Codifier        Exactly
00:59   Codifier        They say, "We're going to Van's Earth"
00:59   Forge   that doesnt change the fact that they have been nowhere other than just his mind
01:00   Effendil        But Van's Earth is our Earth too...
01:00   Codifier        They don't know us
01:00   Codifier        That's nice Forge.
01:00   Effendil        We don't know them too.
01:01   Codifier        What?
01:02   Effendil        Agree that an entity can go in the spirit of Van by using it as an anchor and thus be able to own or just whisper some answers ?
01:02   Codifier        English isn't your first language, is it?
01:02   Forge   thats not the point Effendil
01:03   Forge   they exist nowhere other than just in vans mind
01:03           *** Lookis quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
01:03   Effendil        This is false Forge, it is possible to go in the same astral plane of Equestria.
01:04   Effendil        Some did.
01:04   Codifier        S
01:04   Forge   you have no idea what im actually saying do you
01:04   Forge   celestia that van was "channeling" exists nowhere other than his head
01:04   Codifier        Effendil, Forge is claiming that Van is lying about all the ponies he's channeled
01:04   Forge   that particular entity does not exist in any of the realms other than vans mind
01:04   Forge   no
01:04   Forge   im saying that celestia exists only in vans head
01:04   Forge   im not saying van is lying
01:05   Forge   so dont put words in my mouth
01:05   Codifier        Alright, then tulpa
01:05   Effendil        So for you she could not come from the astral plane ?
01:05   Codifier        It's only a minor difference
01:05   Corr    Forge
01:05   Forge   from what it appears, van believes it
01:05   Corr    hi forge
01:06   mqi3    It's certainly plausible.
01:07   Effendil        Seriously, judging externally something as subjective as it seems to me quite daring.
01:07   Codifier        ^^^
01:07   Forge   can anyone translate for Effendil
01:07   Codifier        He's right, though
01:07   Forge   no
01:07   Forge   stop
01:07   Forge   we arent getting into this argument
01:07   Codifier        It's quite daring to judge a subjective experience externally
01:07   Codifier        Alright.
01:07   Forge   just because you are a nihilist and im not
01:08   Codifier       
01:08   Codifier        Ad hominem
01:08   Forge   and if celestia were from the astral, it wouldnt be a subjective experience
01:08   Codifier        It's subjective to Van
01:08   Effendil        the veil.
01:08   Forge   and if celestia were from the astral, it wouldnt be a subjective experience
01:08   Forge   my point stands
01:08   Effendil        It's what you said, no ?
01:09   mqi3    Is there a way to test?
01:09   Effendil        That's why she couldn't interact with the real world.
01:09   Forge   yeah
01:09   Forge   tracking
01:09   Forge   which is what i did
01:09   Codifier        He was explaining why ponies couldn't be seen physically
01:09   Effendil        Hmm, why there is a veil here and not anywhere in the astral plane ?
01:09   Forge   originally i was tracking that celestia to the ponyland she is from so i can destroy it, but it doesnt exist outside of vans mind
01:10   Effendil        Destroy it, my god...
01:10   mqi3    Any way we can track them ourselves?
01:10   Codifier        (he's talking complete BS, but whatever)
01:10   Forge   be my guest
01:10   mqi3    Don't think people are going to take your word on the matter.
01:10   Forge   i didnt think they would
01:11   mqi3    How do you track, then?
01:11   mqi3    Or is it in one of your guides?
01:11   mqi3    I haven't read all of them yet.
01:11   Forge   its not in one of my guides
01:11   Effendil        I like Forge, when he wants to prove something, he destroys it.
01:12   Corr    Forge has destroyed a "ponyland" before
01:12   Corr    if I'm correct
01:12   Effendil        Ah, and how ?
01:12   Forge   i dont know how to spell the esqueria so i just say ponyland
01:12   Codifier        Hahahaha
01:12   mqi3    I'll be right back.
01:12   Corr    I'm pretty sure
01:12           *** mqi3 quit (Quit: Leaving.)
01:12   Corr    it was with machines
01:12   Effendil        how did you managed to destroy a whole ponyland ?
01:12   Corr    or something
01:12   Forge   because they are not nearly as limitless as you assume
01:13   Effendil        We didn't say that.
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01:13   Forge   and ive been practicing astral projection and energy manipulation for years
01:13   Codifier        (because he's talking complete BS and wants to rustle your jimmies)
01:13   Forge   Codifier shut the fuck up
01:13   Effendil        I just want to know the benefit of doing such a thing?
01:14   mqi3    If it is complete BS, then theres a way to test it.
01:14   mqi3    I'd personally want to cover all bases before I say with certainty that this is how it works.
01:14   mqi3    Especially considering most of us either can't AP or haven't APed much.
01:15   Effendil        Anyway let's face it, no one will understand the workings of the universe one day. We all die before.
01:15   mqi3    I intend to live forever. So far, so good.
01:15   Forge   you are immortal until you die mqi3
01:15   Codifier        The hell?
01:15   Codifier        Oh
01:15   Codifier        That makes sense
01:16   Effendil        Forge will go to hell for destroying a defenseless Ponyland.
01:16   Forge   heh
01:16   Forge   heheh
01:16   Forge   sure
01:17   Effendil        Serious better not have you in front of the astral plane. I would avoid you like the plague.
01:18   mqi3    That implies there is a hell.
01:18   mqi3    Which I highly doubt.
01:18   Effendil        An old man said that power comes responsibility.
01:18   Forge   wait so
01:18   Forge   you believe there are infinite ponylands but no hell
01:18   mqi3    No.
01:18   Effendil        Lol
01:18   mqi3    I don't believe there is infinite ponylands.
01:19   Effendil        You'll be surprised I think.
01:19   mqi3    I don't know what to believe just yet.
01:19   Codifier        I believe what I feel like believing
01:19   Forge   thats a good attitude mqi3
01:19   Forge   YOU CANT BELIEVE ANYTHING CODIFIER CUZ YOU CANT BE SURE SO NOTHING
01:19   Forge   hurr
01:19   mqi3    I believe in the scientific method, and intend to test my experiences with this and see where it takes me.
01:19   Codifier       
01:19   Codifier        Let's see which one that is
01:20   Forge   i was making fun of you
01:20   Forge   for being a fucking idiot
01:20   Forge   so the last one
01:20   Codifier        Ah, that's name-calling
01:20   Effendil        The whole universe including the astral planes did not come out of nowhere. There was an architect somewhere.
01:20   Forge   Effendil, my personal experience says the architect is the unconsciousness.
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01:21   Effendil        And what is the unconsciousness ?
01:21   Forge   everything
01:21   Codifier        Btw, it isn't nihilism
01:21   Codifier        It's solipsism
01:21   Forge   everything in existence is just new ways the unconsciousness is exploring itself
01:21   Effendil        I guess this is what people call God in this case.
01:22   Forge   Codifier i say nihilism because its built on the same belief but saying nihilist makes you sound like the edgy teenager you are
01:22   Forge   not really Effendil
01:22   Forge   god is sentient
01:22   Forge   the unconscious isnt
01:22   Codifier        I don't need to call you anything because you make it obvious how butthurt you are about everything
01:22   Forge   Codifier please stop talking to me
01:22   Codifier        Then stop calling me names~
01:22   Forge   Codifier please stop talking to me
01:23   Codifier        Then stop calling me names~
01:23   Effendil        So the next question: do you believe in God, Forge ?
01:23   Forge   Codifier please stop talking to me
01:23   Codifier        Then stop calling me names~
01:23   Forge   depends on your definition of god Effendil
01:23   Effendil        Tell me yours.
01:23   Forge   if you mean YHVH, jehovas, allah, or God, then yes, this is an entity that exists
01:23   Forge   if you mean a single being that has complete power over everything, then no
01:23   Forge   omniscience and omnipotence do not exist
01:24   Effendil        So there is no intelligence behind the unconscious ?
01:24   Forge   no
01:24   Forge   only existence
01:24   Effendil        Yet the complexity of the world tend to prove the contrary.
01:25   Forge   i didnt say it doesnt have direction
01:25   Forge   whats the best way for the unconscious to experience itself than to become conscious
01:26   Effendil        A part of the unconscious has become conscious I guess, no ?
01:26   Forge   everything is part of the unconsciousness
01:27   Forge   thus consciousness in itself is just another way for the unconsciousness to experience itself
01:27   Forge   so yes
01:27   Effendil        What will happen when all the unconscious becomes conscious?
01:28   Forge   i dont see that as a possibility
01:28   Effendil        The unconscious is it really unlimited ?
01:28   Forge   i dont know
01:29   Effendil        And if you die, what will happen?
01:29   Effendil        I guess you do not believe in heaven or in hell.
01:30   Forge   yes i do
01:30   Forge   all of the different personifications of it exist
01:31   Forge   but that doesnt mean this is where i am going to end up when i die
01:31   Effendil        I know some believe remain in the form of astral body thereafter.
01:32   Forge   thats the plan
01:32   Forge   i like to think of my spiritual journey here on earth as "preparing for retirement"
01:33           *** Lookis quit (Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client)
01:33   Effendil        So I guess all your astral travel and energy manipulation are for you a training for the hereafter ?
                                   ____________________________________________
Forge. One last question, quite important. Can't we choose to go in a world on the astral plane which is an important timing delay time over it ? For example, a world where there one second IRL = One year there.
01:42   Codifier        Can I answer?
01:42   Forge   time is not universal wherever you are, so yes.
01:42   Forge   and no you may not, it was directed to me.
01:42   Codifier        sadface ;_;
01:43   Effendil        By doing this, our experience of life could be greatly extended, right?
01:43   mqi3    If Forge is correct about Van's Equestria, then the reason it abides by Earth's time is because it is a reality perceived entirely in his mind.
01:44   Forge   i didnt say it was his entire ponyland
01:44   Forge   just the entity he was channeling earlier
01:44   Forge   please stop putting words in my mouth
01:44   Forge   and Effendil correct
01:44   Codifier        We're not putting words in your mouth, we're just misunderstanding you
01:45   Effendil        In this case it's perfect. This is what I wanted. Astral projection worth it.
01:45   Codifier        A simple clarification is fine
01:45   Forge   ji clearly stated multiple times it was only a track on the entity he was channeling that he called celestia
01:45   Forge   as far as i can tell, van does project, frequently.
01:45   Codifier        Which has a minor implication that the plane from which she came from was also within his mind
01:45   mqi3    The only reason we put words in your mouth is because you make it so easy.
01:45   Forge   or that he wasnt channeling her at all even though he believes he was
01:46   Forge   which is much more believable to me
01:46   Codifier        But you left that pretty vague
01:46   Effendil        So he made instead a tulpa ?
01:46   Codifier        It was just a misunderstanding, not some malicious attempt to put words in your mouth
01:46   Forge   especially because channeling takes a huge toll on the body and an even bigger one on the mind, even for short periods of time, yet he did it like it was nothing
01:47   Effendil        So channeling could be done ?
01:47   Forge   yes
01:48   Forge   channeling is not fun
01:48   Effendil        It is true that some people do it with the dead, I'm a bit stupid.
01:48   Forge   yes
01:51   Effendil        The fact that Van has interacts with ponies probably created versions of them in his mind, of tulpas basically. Since he already had a tulpa himself, the process has been simplified so that he isn't realized it.
01:51   Forge   tthere is also a good chance that it wasnt a tulpa
01:51   Forge   and was just his imagination
01:52   Akwa    That's what I was worried about, personally
01:52   Codifier        Eh
01:52   Codifier        Doesn't matter in any case
01:52   Effendil        It is not too hard to think clearly after an astral journey too ?
01:53   Forge   not really
01:53   Forge   channeling is just a rather violent experience
01:53   Codifier        Maybe for you..
01:53   Codifier        Anyway
01:53   Codifier        I have to go
01:53   Codifier        Bibi
01:54           *** Codifier quit (Quit: Leaving)